One of our most popular sessions from JourneyCon2024 was our “Marketing Your Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy Practice” expert panel. Journey Clinical Co-founder and CEO Jonathan Sabbagh spoke with 3 expert Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy (KAP) providers based in New York to discuss how they structure their practices around KAP, market their KAP offerings to potential clients, and how they embed accessibility into their work without disregarding their finances.
Thank you to our 3 incredible panelists for this insightful and important discussion:
- Natasha Camille, LCSW: wildestdreamstherapy.com
- Eric Fraser, MT-BC, LCAT: soundandnature.com
- Erica P. Sandoval, LCSW: sandovalcolab.com
Each of their stories highlights how KAP has empowered them to deepen client care while achieving both personal and professional growth. In case you weren’t able to join us, we’ve gathered some of the biggest insights from the discussion below.
How Erica P. Sandoval, LCSW, Developed Her Niche as a Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy Provider
Erica Priscilla Sandoval, LCSW, is a Journey Clinical Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy (KAP) provider based in New York City and Queens. She is the founder of Sandoval CoLab, a mental health group practice with 50 Latina therapists and 4 holistic practitioners that has offered psychedelic group therapy and individual therapy for the past 2 years. You can connect with her through her practice’s website.
Erica’s Schedule
Since joining Journey Clinical 2 years ago, Erica shared that she now works primarily with Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy (KAP) clients, a move that has not only enriched her offerings but significantly impacted her revenue: “I’m the only KAP provider in my practice, and I ebb and flow between 100 patients. I do 4 individual KAP sessions a week, with a group KAP session every quarter.
I also focus on retreats as a more affordable and accessible option. I’m grateful to work in a very beautiful yoga studio. When clients step into the space, they immediately begin to relax and center themselves. Many times, my clients are afraid of trying something new, so we introduce them to the space, our sound healers, and incorporate a lot of holistic practices.”
Accessibility-Conscious Pricing for KAP
Erica emphasizes accessibility for her clients by offering flexible treatment and payment plans: “I’m really proud of the way that my practice makes treatment accessible and affordable for our clients. We center our work with BIPOC communities and it’s really difficult for us to destigmatize KAP within those communities. To address this, I’m always very transparent about the details – including costs. Group work is incredible because the cost can be much lower for the amount of hours of therapy that I provide.’
Erica added: "To accommodate clients who may not be able to afford my normal rates, I may offer alternatives, such as talking to them about group KAP or creating a customized package with a lower price for them.
It works for our clients because they know that we’re meeting them where they are. To be honest, sometimes our clients are other therapists that really want to lean into this modality – they understand the fee structure, so they’re willing to pay for what it’s worth. It really depends on who the patient is, but we make it very affordable and accessible for many communities.”
Impact on Revenue
Erica shared that even with flexible pricing for some of her clients, KAP has been transformative for Erica’s business model and revenue: “It’s been amazing and I’m very grateful for that. I just want to sit with gratitude for a moment, because I wasn’t sure that I would see a return on the money I invested in Psychedelic-Assisted Psychotherapy training at the beginning. The first year of doing KAP, I didn’t see a significant difference because I was still getting comfortable with being in this space and telling others about my work. Then, the referrals started coming in all of a sudden from unexpected sources – people remember, ‘Oh, Erica does KAP. I remember how she transformed after going through her journey and starting her own healing process.’ Other therapists began referring their clients to me. My group practice is a network of many incredible Latina therapists, but not everyone does KAP. When they have clients that they feel may be a great fit, they refer to someone that they know and trust because they’ve seen the work that I have been doing with ketamine.”
Erica spoke about how, since most of her revenue has come from working with KAP clients, she has been able to save money from her group practice and invest it in other resources: “I have a beautiful group practice with other incredible therapists. I’ve noticed that I don’t have to pay myself out as much from the group practice because KAP is paying my salary. I’m able to leave a lot of money in the practice so I can continue to promote the business on social media, attend networking events/conferences, and invest in both myself and my practice.”
Marketing Her KAP Practice and Introducing KAP to Clients
Erica found an increase in referrals when she put more time into marketing herself as a KAP provider and encouraged other therapists to do the same: “I find it interesting that when you’re discussing KAP with potential clients, they may be interested but are not yet ready to speak about it due to shame. I encourage therapists to normalize KAP in their practice. Talk about it on your website and social media so potential clients can find it on their own time. Some people decide that they want to try KAP scrolling late at night. Make sure you have the information in print online so it’s easy for them to reference.
I’m a walking brand. I’ve done a lot of my own healing work with KAP, and am in a better space now. When people see me and ask how I was able to heal and transform my life, I tell them: ‘It’s Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy. It’s been amazing.’ I talk about my healing, and how I’ve healed so many traumas through this modality. You become the brand. If you don't believe in the medicine, potential clients or referrers are never going to see the potential benefits. You have to be able to reflect on how KAP has supported you so you can talk about your experience with others. Then, you need marketing materials – newsletters, social media pages, Instagram lives, co-collaborations, your website and Psychology Today profile. People will begin to remember that this is your niche. When I’m marketing my KAP practice, I always try to incorporate how I’ve been working on myself through this work, so other therapists interested in offering KAP may want to experience the treatment as well.”
When asked for advice on talking about KAP to non-KAP clients for the first time, Erica added: “Sometimes in sessions, something may arise with the client that makes me think that if they can experience this incredible modality, they might be able to process this differently. It depends on the session and what they’re sharing. I know my clients, so I may say ‘Maybe this might be a good time to consider the Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy that we had talked about before. It might help you be able to open up and communicate with your partner.’ Whenever I introduce it to clients, I always relate it to the positive outcome that may be after the KAP experience.”
How Natasha Camille, LCSW, Created a Thriving Private Practice Founded on Accessibility
Natasha Camille, LCSW, is licensed in both New York and New Jersey and founded Wildest Dreams Therapy as a private practice. They mostly support LGBTQ+ and BIPOC individuals in their work and have been a Journey Clinical KAP provider since January 2023. You can connect with them through their website.
Natasha’s Schedule
Natasha shared that after integrating KAP into their practice last year, they now facilitate about 2-3 KAP sessions with clients each week: “I feel like Journey Clinical has opened up the possibilities that I’m able to offer to my clients and has brought new clients as well that are specifically interested in Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy. Between KAP clients who I work with throughout the entire therapeutic process and other clients that just come to me for psychedelic integration, I would say that I have around 25 clients. Many of them are long-term and doing a full 6-8 KAP sessions. Some decide to do more after that, and others are folks who are interested in having ongoing maintenance sessions. I have some clients that book one KAP session every quarter. It varies based on how people choose to incorporate this treatment into their lives.”
Natasha added that focusing more on KAP in their work has led to a reduced mental and physical load, enabling them to show up more fully for their clients and themselves: “I feel a drastic difference in the workload, mental load, and the body load of this work. When I started offering KAP, I was able to invest in myself and my business. I hired an assistant. I was able to take care of myself better, and I feel that was made possible by incorporating KAP into my practice.”
Accessibility-Conscious Pricing
Similar to Erica, Natasha has significantly enhanced their ability to support clients and align their business model with their values of accessibility and equity: “Prioritizing accessibility is something that is extremely important to me. My clients all either identify as queer or trans, and many are people of color. I’m working with people who are marginalized systemically, and that often means that their access to high end services is low. What has really helped me is putting a lot of thought into creating a sliding scale fee structure that takes into account my client’s different identities and experiences that would impact their own earning potential. I have a questionnaire that clients fill out to get an idea of where they fall on the sliding scale and their costs will be according to that.
I also went back and forth with myself about whether or not to price by package (set price based on a total amount of sessions) or by hour before deciding to stick with an hourly rate. I wasn’t sure how I would go about it if someone realized midway through treatment that they didn’t want to continue. It felt important to me to offer that flexibility to my clients. I took all of this information about fees and pricing structure and designed a nice branded guide – that has really helped clients understand the entire breakdown of what they’re paying for, which is extremely important for them. Something else that I think is great about that structure is that it gives people who do have more financial means the option to pay at a redistribution rate, which means that I can now use the surplus that they’re voluntarily paying to put towards services for people who can’t pay. I’m able to offer pro-bono services that way as well, just by charging clients what they can afford. It’s definitely made my practice earn a lot more, and I’m able to do it in a way that feels very aligned with my values.”
Introducing KAP to Their Clients
Natasha uses their personal experience with KAP treatment to normalize the modality for potential clients and spark broader conversations about decriminalization and healing: “I was a Journey Clinical member for probably 2 months before I told anyone because I was concerned about what my clients would think. Then two months in, I thought ‘Why not?’ I started off by incorporating it into my monthly newsletter to my clients. Similar to Erica, I just allowed people who had an interest in KAP to come to me and express that to me. Sometimes I have clients who don’t ask about KAP specifically, but they will express that they’re interested in trying something different that can help them break out of patterns more than therapy. We’ll talk about it individually during a therapy session and discuss whether it’s a good fit and why specifically. I think it’s important that people understand that it’s not this vague thing, and that there are specific reasons why I believe ketamine would be a good treatment for them in particular. We have those conversations.”
Marketing their KAP Practice Through Social Media
Natasha shared how they use social media to normalize the modality and spark broader conversations about decriminalization and healing: “I use it continue an ongoing conversation with not only my clients, but also prospective clients, other therapists, and people in the Psychedelic-Assisted Psychotherapy community in general. I like to share not only my perspective as a therapist, but also my perspective as a person who underwent KAP treatment. I share a lot about the political nature of decriminalizing substances and how the war on drugs has impacted people of color. I’m trying to normalize these treatments by talking about it, because we just should be talking about it as a society.”
How Eric Fraser, LCAT Incorporates Music Therapy into a Thriving KAP Practice
Eric Fraser, MT-BC, LCAT is a licensed creative arts therapist in Germantown, New York. As one of our most experienced Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy (KAP) providers, he has been a Journey Clinical member since 2022 and his unique approach weaves together Indian classical music, somatic techniques, and attachment therapy to address developmental trauma, depression, and anxiety. You can learn more about Eric through his recent member feature and connect with him through his website.
Eric’s Schedule
Over the past two and a half years, Eric has facilitated more KAP sessions than any other Journey Clinical psychotherapist, transforming his work and tripling his revenue while deepening his clients' healing journeys: “I work with a caseload of about 20-30 clients, and would estimate that around 50-60% of them are active KAP clients. They can ebb and flow anywhere from 2 to 7 KAP sessions a week.”
Eric shared that he was recently able to buy property to accommodate group work in his practice: “I’ve only worked with individuals at this point, and am looking forward to doing group KAP. I’ve manifested a really nice space to start doing group work, which is a dream come true. Working with Journey Clinical for the last 2 and a half years has transformed my work as a professional therapist into fully private practice and has made a lot of my dreams come more to life.”
Impact on Revenue and Determining Pricing for Clients
Eric shared that integrating KAP into his practice has tripled his revenue without going against his values: “Financially, it’s lifted me significantly – going into private practice is the best choice that I made in business. KAP has become much much of my client base. I look at myself as a private practitioner. I’m not here to make as much money as possible – I’ve always been oriented to that healing spirit. When we can have enough resources that we can care for ourselves better, we can truly show up to do this work in a deeper way that will benefit more people.”
Like Erica and Natasha, Eric also spoke about how he highlights accessibility in his work: “I structured my KAP practice based on making it affordable for what I think is a fair exchange of time. I reduce the hourly rate for my KAP clients because they’re spending more time with me. I also work with insurance.
Packages have always been a good way for me to structure things. I have a KAP introductory package because when you start treatment with Journey Clinical, you get a prescription for 2 KAP sessions. I always tell clients that this is how it starts, and a real KAP protocol is going to be 6-8 sessions. Many people go for longer-term treatment and have maintenance sessions. That first package is 2 dosing sessions, 2 preparation sessions, and 2 integration sessions. Even within that, we can discuss accommodations. Sometimes I do a sliding scale for preparation sessions. We always do 3 hours for the first dosing session, but if afterwards my client feels like we can have a successful and beneficial session within 2 hours, we can reduce costs there as well. It varies – folks who have more money are willing to pay my standard rate, but others may ask if we can have a longer conversation about it.”
Talking to Clients about KAP
When asked about how he introduces KAP to clients, Eric shared the importance of properly communicating the experience to them: “When clients are trying to determine if you are a supportive space where they can have a psychedelic experience like this, part of it is their way of orienting to it. If you only do standard talk therapy and they are always sitting on the couch, there may be some sense of ‘What is it going to look like if we do KAP together?’ A way to introduce it to them is not only tell them about the work, but also do small exercises like ‘What would it be like to lie down and see if you can find safety in your body? Let’s listen to some music. Let’s do things that are more experience-oriented. When we do this, clients can start to see what a KAP session between us would look like.”
Marketing His Practice Through SEO
Eric spoke about the importance of word of mouth, and optimizing your searchability online to receive referrals: “I have a fair amount of word of mouth and I make myself searchable on Google. A Google Business page is a good idea – potential clients may search ‘ketamine treatment near me.’ If your name pops up, it’s going to help your business. For word of mouth, I think a lot of referrals have been individuals that my clients shared their experience with. You can see that KAP is really working for people when they just go and openly share ‘This has been great for me.’”
You can access the full recording here.